Author Topic: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis  (Read 2143 times)

Offline ctc

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Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« on: February 03, 2014, 02:43:36 pm »
The debate will pull a massive audience.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/2014/02/03/debate-science-guys-media

PETERSBURG, Ky., February 3, 2014—As Bill Nye “The Science Guy” of TV renown and Ken Ham founder of the Creation Museum prepare their cases in what has been dubbed “Scopes 2,” the February 4, 7 PM (ET) debate is drawing major international attention.

    CNN’s Tom Foreman will be the debate moderator.
    In addition to CNN correspondent Tom Foreman who will moderate the debate, over 70 credentialed media will be in attendance, such as ABC, NBC, Scientific American magazine, Sydney Morning Herald (Australia), Al Jazeera, The New Yorker, etc.
    Over 10,000 churches, schools, colleges, and other groups have informed the museum through www.debatelive.org that they will be carrying the free live stream of the debate. (That is just the number of groups that have actually told the Creation Museum of their plans.) Liberty University in Virginia, which conferred an honorary doctorate on Ham, will show a live stream of the debate in a 1,500-seat auditorium on campus.
    In addition to group leaders, the museum has heard from tens of thousands of individuals who have shared via www.debatelive.org that they will be watching. All told, more than one million people—as a part of groups or as individuals—have already informed the museum they will be viewing the debate. With the addition of people who have not contacted the museum about their intent to watch (it is not necessary to register to view the live stream), it is clear that many more than one million people will be watching.
    People who purchased debate tickets when they went on sale online January 2 (tickets sold out in two minutes) represent 29 states and one country (Belize).
    Immediately at the conclusion of the debate, Bill Nye and Ken Ham will walk inside the Creation Museum next door to be interviewed for the Piers Morgan Live program on CNN for a 9:45 PM post-debate analysis. During the 10 PM hour and inside the museum, MSNBC TV will interview Mr. Nye by himself.

    Bill Nye “The Science Guy”
    On a special website, a live stream of the debate will have nationally certified ASL interpreters signing (and at no charge), at www.debateliveASL.org
    The museum website as well as the website of the parent ministry that runs the museum, Answers in Genesis, have seen an 80% increase in traffic, totaling about two million visits in January alone. Most of this jump is due to interest in the debate.

The agreed-upon topic for the debate at the Creation Museum’s 900-seat Legacy Hall auditorium in Petersburg, Kentucky (near Cincinnati) is: “Is creation a viable model of origins in today's modern scientific era?”
Several are on "ignore".   I won't argue with the ignorant and disrespectful..
 "People almost invariably arrive at their beliefs not on the basis of proof but on the basis of what they find attractive" ~ Blaise Pascal

Offline coachsparky

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2014, 06:38:06 pm »
http://m.phys.org/_news165555744.html

Quote
For a group of paleontologists, a tour of the Creation Museum seemed like a great tongue-in-cheek way to cap off a serious conference.

But while there were a few laughs and some clowning for the camera, most left more offended than amused by the frightening way in which evolution -- and their life's work -- was attacked.

"It's sort of a monument to scientific illiteracy, isn't it?" said Jerry Lipps, professor of geology, paleontology and evolution at University of California, Berkeley.

"Like Sunday school with statues... this is a special brand of religion here. I don't think even most mainstream Christians would believe in this interpretation of Earth's history."

The 27 million dollar, 70,000-square-foot (6,500-square-metre) museum which has been dubbed a "creationist Disneyland" has attracted 715,000 visitors since it opened in mid-2007 with a vow to "bring the pages of the Bible to life."

Its presents a literal interpretation of the Bible and argues that believing otherwise leads to moral relativism and the destruction of social values.

Creationism is a theory not supported by most mainstream Christian churches.

Lisa Park of the University of Akron cried at one point as she walked a hallway full of flashing images of war, famine and natural disasters which the museum blames on belief in evolution.

"I think it's very bad science and even worse theology -- and the theology is far more offensive to me," said Park, a professor of paleontology who is an elder in the Presbyterian Church.

"I think there's a lot of focus on fear, and I don't think that's a very Christian message... I find it a malicious manipulation of the public."

Phil Jardine posed for a picture below a towering, toothy dinosaur display.

The museum argues that the fossil record has been misinterpreted and that Tyrannosaurus rex was a vegetarian before Adam and Eve bit into that sin-inducing apple.

Jardine, a palaeobiologist graduate student from the University of Birmingham, was having fun on the tour, but told a reporter that he was disturbed by the museum's cartoonish portrayal of scientists and teachers.

"I feel very sorry for teachers when the children who come here start guessing if what they're being taught is wrong," Jardine said.

Arnie Miller, a palentologist at the University of Cincinnati who was chairman of the convention, said he hoped the tour would introduce the scientists to "the lay of the land" and show them firsthand what's being put forth in a place that has elicited vehement criticism from the scientific community.

"I think in some cases, people were surprised by the physical quality of the exhibits, but needless to say, they were unhappy with things that are inaccurately portrayed," he said.

"And there was a feeling of unhappiness, too, about the extent to which mainstream scientists and evolutionists are demonized -- that if you don't accept the Answers in Genesis vision of the history of Earth and life, you're contributing to the ills of society and of the church."

Daryl Domning, professor of anatomy at Howard University, held his chin and shook his head at several points during the tour.

"This bothers me as a scientist and as a Christian, because it's just as much a distortion and misrepresentation of Christianity as it is of science," he said.

"It's not your old-time religion by any means."
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY

Offline ctc

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2014, 09:12:21 am »
Debate is tonight 6 pm CST
Several are on "ignore".   I won't argue with the ignorant and disrespectful..
 "People almost invariably arrive at their beliefs not on the basis of proof but on the basis of what they find attractive" ~ Blaise Pascal

Offline coachsparky

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We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY

Offline SVV

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2014, 11:08:28 pm »
My video was choppy, not sure about y'alls.  Both had a few bullet points that were stuck to, Nye's mainly being "Ken Ham's view of our world (kind of used as an insult)," and that we as a country need to do all that we can to insure that the right science is being taught, not Creationism, or else we'll crumble into oblivion, and Ham's being "GOOOOOOOOOOOOOODDDDDDDDDDDDD," and "look at all these other PhD scientists that also believe what I do."
Ham rehashed his same shtick.
Nye proposed several questions that were never answered, or answered appropriately.
They both intermixed biological evolution with cosmology partly due to audience input and Ham not being able to distinguish between the two.
Nye and Ham were both well received by the audience and each came across as regular blokes with their intermingled jokes.
The format was easily followed and all seemed to run smooth. 

As a head to head, Nye won.

Offline SVV

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2014, 12:05:37 am »

Offline SVV

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2014, 12:19:29 am »
Quote
And into this world steps Bill Nye, the Science Guy, with a few cheesy jokes, a nervous laugh or two, and an occasional bullet of science knowledge to throw in. Bill didn't exactly come across as the world's greatest debater here, and I still wonder if he really knew what he was in for tonight. It says something, though, that Ham was so over the top, so willfully ignorant, so rambling and repetitive and most importantly, obviously wrong, that Nye managed to come right into his home turf and wipe the floor with him.

I know some people hope that Nye was able to instill just a little doubt in a believer here or there. I have a different hope: that moderate Christians, watching this debate, will come away from it, if not faithless, at least opposed to Ham's beliefs getting pushed into public schools. I hope the real message that gets across is one that solidifies Ham's image as a loon, not just to us atheists, but to anyone on a local school board with a vote and decision to make.
-Aetre

Offline coachsparky

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2014, 06:45:18 am »
http://guardianlv.com/2014/02/bill-nye-ken-ham-debate-in-depth-recap-synopsis-and-who-won/

Quote
The Bill Nye vs. Ken Ham debate has just concluded, and  Nye has emerged the clear winner. The event has been widely anticipated for weeks, and was available for free on YouTube. The recorded event can also be accessed on YouTube for a period of time. DVDs and downloads are also available for purchase on the Creation Museum’s website. Here is an in-depth recap and synopsis of the events as they unfolded, leading up to the dramatic victory of  Nye, much to the delight of the secular community.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In the Bill Nye vs. Ken Ham debate, the answer to those asking who won is: it’s clear Nye emerged the winner because he relied on a large amount of fossil and scientific evidence. Ham relied almost exclusively on the Bible and provided no fossil or scientific evidence whatsoever. As predicted, the debate was friendly and completely civil. In addition to this in depth synopsis and recap, the debate will be available at debatearchive.org for a few days, and on YouTube.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY

Offline ctc

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2014, 08:38:12 am »
My video was choppy, not sure about y'alls.  Both had a few bullet points that were stuck to, Nye's mainly being "Ken Ham's view of our world (kind of used as an insult)," and that we as a country need to do all that we can to insure that the right science is being taught, not Creationism, or else we'll crumble into oblivion, and Ham's being "GOOOOOOOOOOOOOODDDDDDDDDDDDD," and "look at all these other PhD scientists that also believe what I do."
Ham rehashed his same shtick.
Nye proposed several questions that were never answered, or answered appropriately.
They both intermixed biological evolution with cosmology partly due to audience input and Ham not being able to distinguish between the two.
Nye and Ham were both well received by the audience and each came across as regular blokes with their intermingled jokes.
The format was easily followed and all seemed to run smooth. 

As a head to head, Nye won.
Your analysis is actually pretty good.  You are correct, Ham did not address Nye's questions.  Also, Nye did not address Ham's questions.  The debate was really unproductive and failed to meet expectations.  Ham proposed that historical science had nothing to do with operational science and Nye insisted that our science in the USA is sub par to the rest of the world because of creationism.  Ham needed to address some questions and Nye needed to explain how we are sub par.  Both failed.  There was no winner.
Several are on "ignore".   I won't argue with the ignorant and disrespectful..
 "People almost invariably arrive at their beliefs not on the basis of proof but on the basis of what they find attractive" ~ Blaise Pascal

Offline SVV

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2014, 09:06:41 am »
Kudos to you for admitting Ham's failure.  We both may disagree on whether there was a winner, but at least you noticed Ham's inability to address the specifics of the discussion, at least without anything substantial.


Offline coachsparky

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #10 on: February 05, 2014, 09:18:24 pm »
http://www.salon.com/2014/02/05/bill_nye_on_creationism_show_me_one_piece_of_evidence_and_i_would_change_my_mind_immediately/?source=huffpo

Quote
It’s the 21st century, but the debate over evolution is alive and well. In a live showdown that pitted Darwin against the word of God, 90′s icon Bill Nye took on Australian young-Earth creationist Ken Ham on Ham’s turf, the Creation Museum in Kentucky.

As with most debates, it was obvious before it began that neither was going to convince the other to change his fundamental world view. There were plenty of questions that Nye, leaning on science, couldn’t provide an answer for, but he treated those moments not as defeats but as reasons to be excited about the possibilities of scientific inquiry. Ham, meanwhile, took comfort in what Nye referred to as his “literal interpretation of most parts of the Bible,” reconciling anything he couldn’t answer with the response that God’s word is “the only thing that makes logical sense.”

That all was further confirmed when a member of the audience asked what turned out to be the crux of the debate: what, if anything, would convince the men to change their minds? Ham’s answer: “I’m a Christian.” (In other words, nothing.) Nye, on the other hand, was happy to concede that just one piece of evidence to support a Biblical interpretation of Earth’s formation — that the universe is not expanding, or that rock layers can somehow form in just 4,000 years — would cause him to change his mind “immediately.”

Also telling were their responses to the final question: “What is the one thing, more than anything else, upon which you base your belief?” Ham took the opportunity to proselytize about that very unique and special book, while Nye advocated for a different sort of wonder:

“I base my beliefs on the information and the process that we call science…It fills me with joy to know that we can pursue these answers. It is a wonderful and astonishing thing to me that you and I…have come to be because of the universe’s existence,” he said.

He then closed by reminding his audience of the stakes (in case anyone needs reminding, here’s a chart showing how Americans’ acceptance of evolution compares to other countries, and here’s a map showing where public schools are allowed to teach creationism): “If we abandon all that we’ve learned about nature and our place in it, if we abandon the process by which we know it, if we let go of everything people have learned before us, if we stop driving forward, looking for answers to the next question, we, in the United States, will be outcompeted by other countries…We have to embrace science education. We have to keep science education in science classes.”

So who won? That, of course, depends on who you ask.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/bigphotos/21329204.html

http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2014/01/creationism_in_public_schools_mapped_where_tax_money_supports_alternatives.html
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY

Offline coachsparky

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Re: Bill Nye the science guy and Ken Ham of Answersingenesis
« Reply #11 on: February 05, 2014, 10:07:16 pm »
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY