Author Topic: Ignorant refs  (Read 7887 times)

Offline Intensity guru

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Ignorant refs
« on: February 09, 2015, 04:59:11 PM »
It's time we had a national conversation about stalling. Are these refs just ignorant or are they trying to make a point? What's going on here?
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Offline heelpick

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2015, 05:05:47 PM »
It just isn't called like it should be.  Dancing around, not taking shots, and tying up doing nothing is accepted practice now.

Offline lkwdsteve

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2015, 05:42:45 PM »
If the three foot zone, discussed in another thread, had been in play for penalizing step backs, Delgado would have been penalized four times for  backing up  to the edge with only handfighting done (no shots OR tie ups).

Offline lkwdsteve

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2015, 06:40:12 PM »
EDIT--Ill vs. Wisc. Watched again and revised to two points for Jimenez on step backs.

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2015, 07:28:56 PM »
I really don't think we need rules that dictate how a wrestler attacks or defends. When a guy is truly stalling, we pretty much all know it. An example of ignorant refs would be; A guy stands up from bottom 15 times in a row, and just happens to get worked toward the edge and pushed out every time. Same guy, now exhausted, gets stuck on bottom with a leg in and an armbar and whammy, he's hit for stalling. We see this crap all the time in our sport.
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Offline RYou

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2015, 08:56:05 PM »
About the only obvious recognition by the refs is the 5 second count when hanging on a leg.

Offline AKIN

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2015, 09:34:21 PM »
If you, as the official, are bored during a match, someone is stalling. Make the call!!!
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Offline ctc

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2015, 10:48:50 PM »
This dilemma has been going on for quite some time now.  The NCAA seems to be ignorantly deaf.
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Offline Ray Brinzer

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2015, 11:00:42 PM »
I haven't been tuned in lately, but this sort of thing is more often cowardice than ignorance.

Offline AFHawk86

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2015, 12:06:19 AM »
I haven't been tuned in lately, but this sort of thing is more often cowardice than ignorance.
+1
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Offline TobusRex

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2015, 09:21:07 AM »
Stalling is out of control. Was watching the Minnesota/Ohio State match. That match between Synder/Schiller was ridiculous. Schiller didn't take any real shots until the very end, he stalled and never got warned. Snyder took the only shots. Schiller just pushed Snyder around, no attempt to shoot. I think the rules need to reflect that simply tying up and pushing isn't considered "offense".
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Offline brycemus

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2015, 09:30:08 AM »
I agree that it's more cowardice than anything.  There are times you can see referees bowing to the will of the arena, and there are times when you can see them make up their mind that they are afraid to look weak and do that.  I heard a referee remark in the tunnel to another official at a Carver meet his season, "you can't let the crowd think they control you".  I mean how often do you see a referee make the difficult and often unpopular decision to give that next stall call and the point that would send the match into overtime?  The last time I can remember it was a M* at Nationals in St Louis.  And I only remember it because my wife took off her shoe and prepared to throw it at him (M* not the referee). 

If referees were more apt to call "double stall" warnings and were not afraid to make that call to send it into OT where the two wrestlers can start over, I think things would sort themselves out.  No wrestler wants to go into OT.
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Offline 1stplace

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2015, 10:23:11 AM »
About the only obvious recognition by the refs is the 5 second count when hanging on a leg.

A 5 count is way too long. Should be a 2 count. Kelly literally pulled Frey around the mat 2 full times and the official only made it to a 4 count

Offline brycemus

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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2015, 11:11:45 AM »
I agree on that count being Way to slow.  I think the same with the return counts.  should be same pace as nearfall.
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Re: Ignorant refs
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2015, 06:33:35 PM »
Stalling is out of control. Was watching the Minnesota/Ohio State match. That match between Synder/Schiller was ridiculous. Schiller didn't take any real shots until the very end, he stalled and never got warned. Snyder took the only shots. Schiller just pushed Snyder around, no attempt to shoot. I think the rules need to reflect that simply tying up and pushing isn't considered "offense".
This is what I mean about rules that would dictate how a wrestler attacks. Pressuring and hand fighting is absolutely offense. If you don't compromise an opponents position in some way before you attack, the odds of being scored on defensively skyrocket. You don't have to shoot in order to score offensively. You can still throw or trip or snap or off-balance a guy in order to score, so forcing a wrestler in to a particular attack in order to avoid a stalling call is equally ignorant refereeing. Having said that, it's quite obvious to most wrestling people when a guy is just blocking and pushing and trying to appear offensive vs actually trying to break position and create scoring opportunities. I really feel like refs are just too far removed from the room/sport at times and lose touch with the particulars.
I always bring my hips to the party.