Author Topic: National Duals  (Read 7653 times)

Offline RYou

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National Duals
« on: January 12, 2016, 06:19:03 AM »
Well, Penn State broke down.  Could it be because they are the host school this year?

And, there's a bit of a different format this year..  Per the NWCA....

FORMAT: On February 14, 2016, the top 8 BigTen teams will be selected to participate based on their NWCA Coaches Poll Rankings. The dual meet champion from the 7 “non bigTen” conferences will also receive an automatic bid to participate.  One “non BigTen” wild card team will be chosen based on its coaches poll ranking to round out the field of 16 teams.

DATE: Sunday, February 21, 2016 (Finals may be moved to Monday, February 22 to accommodate TV)

LOCATION: (8) Big Ten Schools (To be determined by Sunday, February 14, 2016).    Several team schedules including PSU and OKlaSU indicate it will be at Penn State.


Offline SetonHallPirate

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2016, 06:41:46 PM »
The top eight Big Ten teams will each host non-Big Ten teams, in "bowls". For instance, as it looks right now, Penn State would host North Carolina State in the National Dual Championship Bowl, Iowa would host Missouri, and so on, and so forth.

Offline RYou

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2016, 08:35:42 PM »
It's all scheduled for Feb 21 and they are trying to get the finals televised, most likely on the 22nd for the finals.  That means they are all going to be in University Park not the regional the week prior like last year.   Check out Okie State schedule from their web page, they're penciled in to be in State College.

Penn State is calling it the Championship Duals.  Okie State calls it the Bowl Dual Series on the 21st and 22nd. Ohio State calls it the NWCA Championship Duals. Iowa calls it the National Duals on the 20th.  NC State calls it the National Duals but on the 19th.  Cornell - National Duals but on the 22nd.

"TICKETS: Will be sold by each individual Big Ten School"

Offline SetonHallPirate

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2016, 12:46:37 AM »
It's all scheduled for Feb 21 and they are trying to get the finals televised, most likely on the 22nd for the finals.  That means they are all going to be in University Park not the regional the week prior like last year.   Check out Okie State schedule from their web page, they're penciled in to be in State College.

Penn State is calling it the Championship Duals.  Okie State calls it the Bowl Dual Series on the 21st and 22nd. Ohio State calls it the NWCA Championship Duals. Iowa calls it the National Duals on the 20th.  NC State calls it the National Duals but on the 19th.  Cornell - National Duals but on the 22nd.

"TICKETS: Will be sold by each individual Big Ten School"
Again, no. They are all going to be at A Big Ten school, but not necessarily Penn State. Penn State's home meet will be at Rec Hall (BJC is in use...it's THON weekend at Penn State). Iowa's will be at Carver. Ohio State's will be at St. John. Nebraska's will be at Devaney. Michigan's will be at Cliff Keen. And so on, and so on. (my guess is that Illinois and Rutgers will both be in on the act as well, although neither list National Duals on their schedule...as far as #8, I have no idea...there's quite the division between the top seven and the bottom seven in the Big Ten)

Offline RYou

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2016, 08:39:10 PM »
That fits with the "tickets sold at each B1G school statement.  I presume the 8 winners will amass for more competition the next day.

Some of these teams have duals scheduled for Fri the 19th.

Well unless they publish more about how they are going pull this off, attendance is going to be crap except for the likes of Iowa and Nebraska.

Offline SetonHallPirate

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2016, 11:02:05 PM »
That fits with the "tickets sold at each B1G school statement.  I presume the 8 winners will amass for more competition the next day.

Some of these teams have duals scheduled for Fri the 19th.

Well unless they publish more about how they are going pull this off, attendance is going to be crap except for the likes of Iowa and Nebraska.
No, there is no advancement structure. This was done based on the bowl system (pre-CFP).

Offline RYou

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2016, 07:17:06 AM »
So unlike past years, there will be 8 dual meets but no advancement ?  How then are they stating the "finals" may be moved to Monday Feb 22nd for television?


DATE: Sunday, February 21, 2016 (Finals may be moved to Monday, February 22 to accommodate TV)


To have a final doesn't there need to be a boil down to two?

Is this more of a B1G challenge?  8 B1Gs vs 7 dual leaders for other conferences and an at-large team?

You're explanation is more vague than the NWCA.

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2016, 10:23:33 AM »
So unlike past years, there will be 8 dual meets but no advancement ?  How then are they stating the "finals" may be moved to Monday Feb 22nd for television?


DATE: Sunday, February 21, 2016 (Finals may be moved to Monday, February 22 to accommodate TV)


To have a final doesn't there need to be a boil down to two?

Is this more of a B1G challenge?  8 B1Gs vs 7 dual leaders for other conferences and an at-large team?

You're explanation is more vague than the NWCA.

The "finals", as I understand it, is simply the dual between the top ranked B1G team and the top ranked non-B1G team.  It is, as has been said, like the old BCS system where the rankings determine which "game" you get a bid to.

Offline TobusRex

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2016, 10:29:11 AM »
Except the B1G is the wrestling equivalent of the SEC?

I get the B1G is great and respect their commitment to wrestling, but I think they get too many bids to NCAAs. When 10 guys at a weight qualify from one conference at HWT...that's pretty ridiculous. (They were pretty much the 10 best though, lol).
Have you got to get rid of all your knowledge and all your common sense to save your soul? - Clarence Darrow

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2016, 11:54:09 AM »
Except the B1G is the wrestling equivalent of the SEC?

I get the B1G is great and respect their commitment to wrestling, but I think they get too many bids to NCAAs. When 10 guys at a weight qualify from one conference at HWT...that's pretty ridiculous. (They were pretty much the 10 best though, lol).

The B1G is far more dominant in wrestling than the SEC is in football.  The too many bids thing is a garbage argument.  If you want the best 330 guys at NCAAs then the numbers suggest the B1G gets LESS bids than they should (likely due to the auto-qualifier rule).  If you don't want the best 330 at NCAAs then make whatever argument you want, you've started from a flawed premise.

Offline TobusRex

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2016, 12:15:40 PM »
Except the B1G is the wrestling equivalent of the SEC?

I get the B1G is great and respect their commitment to wrestling, but I think they get too many bids to NCAAs. When 10 guys at a weight qualify from one conference at HWT...that's pretty ridiculous. (They were pretty much the 10 best though, lol).

The B1G is far more dominant in wrestling than the SEC is in football.  The too many bids thing is a garbage argument.  If you want the best 330 guys at NCAAs then the numbers suggest the B1G gets LESS bids than they should (likely due to the auto-qualifier rule).  If you don't want the best 330 at NCAAs then make whatever argument you want, you've started from a flawed premise.

I get that. What I don't get is why 10 guys from a conference qualify for a national tourney where only 8 guys place.I'd rather fill in the brackets with D2 and D3 studs than 9th place guys from the B1G. Granted D2/D3 guys aren't invited anymore...but maybe they should be.

Inviting 9th place guys from a conference tourney to the "postseason" is akin to a 2-14 team making the NFL playoffs.
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Offline LILHOWDOG

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2016, 12:20:24 PM »
Except the B1G is the wrestling equivalent of the SEC?

I get the B1G is great and respect their commitment to wrestling, but I think they get too many bids to NCAAs. When 10 guys at a weight qualify from one conference at HWT...that's pretty ridiculous. (They were pretty much the 10 best though, lol).

The B1G is far more dominant in wrestling than the SEC is in football.  The too many bids thing is a garbage argument.  If you want the best 330 guys at NCAAs then the numbers suggest the B1G gets LESS bids than they should (likely due to the auto-qualifier rule).  If you don't want the best 330 at NCAAs then make whatever argument you want, you've started from a flawed premise.

I get that. What I don't get is why 10 guys from a conference qualify for a national tourney where only 8 guys place.I'd rather fill in the brackets with D2 and D3 studs than 9th place guys from the B1G. Granted D2/D3 guys aren't invited anymore...but maybe they should be.

Inviting 9th place guys from a conference tourney to the "postseason" is akin to a 2-14 team making the NFL playoffs.

What do you want?  An 8 man bracket?

Offline fsgrecofolk

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2016, 12:28:07 PM »
So it isn't really a dual meet championship except in name only?

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2016, 01:38:49 PM »
Except the B1G is the wrestling equivalent of the SEC?

I get the B1G is great and respect their commitment to wrestling, but I think they get too many bids to NCAAs. When 10 guys at a weight qualify from one conference at HWT...that's pretty ridiculous. (They were pretty much the 10 best though, lol).

The B1G is far more dominant in wrestling than the SEC is in football.  The too many bids thing is a garbage argument.  If you want the best 330 guys at NCAAs then the numbers suggest the B1G gets LESS bids than they should (likely due to the auto-qualifier rule).  If you don't want the best 330 at NCAAs then make whatever argument you want, you've started from a flawed premise.

I get that. What I don't get is why 10 guys from a conference qualify for a national tourney where only 8 guys place.I'd rather fill in the brackets with D2 and D3 studs than 9th place guys from the B1G. Granted D2/D3 guys aren't invited anymore...but maybe they should be.

Inviting 9th place guys from a conference tourney to the "postseason" is akin to a 2-14 team making the NFL playoffs.

The D2/D3 thing is a different argument that is kind of pointless because no matter what the fans want, it isn't coming back anytime soon.

That said, your 2-14 remark is exactly the sort of backwards thinking that keeps this topic alive when it should have died a long time ago.  It isn't at all like a 2-14 team making the NFL play-offs.  That would imply that either people are getting in that shouldn't (a 2-14 team jumping others with better records) or that we are letting 90-100% of competitors in (a 2-14 team makes it because everyone does).  Neither are true and you are taking the Big 10 tournament in a vacuum rather than considering how it relates to the larger system.  But you know all this already and continue to troll.  I hope you're enjoying it.

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: National Duals
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2016, 01:39:46 PM »
So it isn't really a dual meet championship except in name only?

Pretty much.  I imagine they will crown the winner of the "finals" as champion, but it will mean even less than the old tournament structure did.