Author Topic: Cox & Dlagnev  (Read 3829 times)

Offline BigJ

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2016, 12:26:14 PM »
The shot clock is too subjective.

Agreed, his opponent defended for 6 minutes and won.  Wasn't placed on clock in 2nd.

Offline FalconWrestlingKY

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2016, 12:28:14 PM »
I remember watching Cox fail to get a push out early in the match and I thought "his lack of freestyle experience may hurt him today"

Sure enough it did, he was obviously wrestling passive after he got the push out and it makes sense he thought he was ahead.
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Offline ctc

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2016, 03:02:10 PM »
Cox apparently confirmed that he thought he was winning, despite the coaches saying they were screaming that he was down (and the scoreboard showed the same).

Penalties have always out-ranked on mat action and the shot-clock IS a penalty.  We can talk about the way its called and I'd largely agree (I have a theory I might write about after the Olympics as to why it appears so strange), but it is consistent with all the other rules.

Rules are arbitrary.  ALL rules.  These are made up competitions.  Any change would be good in some ways and bad in others.  Arguing that we don't like the rules because our guy didn't know them/understand how to win the match is just whining.
Way too subjective of a penalty.  Cox messed up late by not knowing the situation and not listening to his coaches.
Several are on "ignore".   I won't argue with the ignorant and disrespectful..
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Offline FalconWrestlingKY

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2016, 04:01:10 PM »
Can we all agree that stalling isn't much better?

Not saying any of us think stalling is better than passivity (I greatly prefer the latter myself) but we have our own subjective penalties in America that are a problem
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Offline RYou

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #19 on: August 20, 2016, 04:18:58 PM »
WOW !

Offline Jointdoc55

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2016, 04:22:35 PM »
Amazing finish to the Cox match! I'm not certain that it was a TD, but he did take all the shots in the match, as I recall.

Offline FalconWrestlingKY

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2016, 04:43:03 PM »
It's one of those 50/50 calls but the fact that a call was actually overturned says a lot about the strength of that takedown.

But I honestly wouldn't have been surprised if they hadn't decided to reward the takedown
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Offline fsgrecofolk

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #22 on: August 20, 2016, 04:46:01 PM »
It really was a coin flip type call.

Offline RYou

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #23 on: August 20, 2016, 04:54:52 PM »
Help me understand these international rules.  I understand, he who scores last when it ends in a tie, wins - most of the time.

In his loss to the Turk, Cox gave up the first point on the shot clock.  0-1.  Cox then ties it with an offensive point with the push out.  But he loses because of giving up the shot clock point first.

In his bronze match, Cox scores the first point on the shot clock 1-0. The Cuban is about to tie it off the shot clock and according to the ref does with no TD before the whistle, 1-1.  Now according to the rules, since the Cuban scored on the shot clock last e would have won if not for the successful challenge.

Given these two circumstances, the offensive push out point carries less weight than a passivity point off the shot clock.  Is that correct?

Offline FalconWrestlingKY

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #24 on: August 20, 2016, 05:01:20 PM »
Help me understand these international rules.  I understand, he who scores last when it ends in a tie, wins - most of the time.

In his loss to the Turk, Cox gave up the first point on the shot clock.  0-1.  Cox then ties it with an offensive point with the push out.  But he loses because of giving up the shot clock point first.

In his bronze match, Cox scores the first point on the shot clock 1-0. The Cuban is about to tie it off the shot clock and according to the ref does with no TD before the whistle, 1-1.  Now according to the rules, since the Cuban scored on the shot clock last e would have won if not for the successful challenge.

Given these two circumstances, the offensive push out point carries less weight than a passivity point off the shot clock.  Is that correct?

Yes the push out carries less weight than the shot clock penalty. It's something I have issues with because I feel we have an issue where the spirit of the law is counteracting the practice of the law. Honestly I think Greco does a better job of calling passivity than freestyle does and the Cox loss in the semifinals shows that.
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Offline RYou

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #25 on: August 20, 2016, 05:18:15 PM »
lasted 31 seconds this time.  Injury ?

Offline Jointdoc55

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #26 on: August 20, 2016, 05:19:40 PM »
lasted 31 seconds this time.  Injury ?
Must be. I saw him since as the match ended, but he didn't limp or hold any body parts.

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #27 on: August 20, 2016, 05:43:08 PM »
Help me understand these international rules.  I understand, he who scores last when it ends in a tie, wins - most of the time.

In his loss to the Turk, Cox gave up the first point on the shot clock.  0-1.  Cox then ties it with an offensive point with the push out.  But he loses because of giving up the shot clock point first.

In his bronze match, Cox scores the first point on the shot clock 1-0. The Cuban is about to tie it off the shot clock and according to the ref does with no TD before the whistle, 1-1.  Now according to the rules, since the Cuban scored on the shot clock last e would have won if not for the successful challenge.

Given these two circumstances, the offensive push out point carries less weight than a passivity point off the shot clock.  Is that correct?

Yes, because the shot clock point is a caution and a point.  If the score is tied and the size of the scores is the same (not one guy has a 2 and the other guy has scored 1 twice), number of cautions is the next criteria.  That is why its worth "more".  The caution is often glossed over, but its why the official puts his other hand out while awarding the 1.

Offline lkwdsteve

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #28 on: August 20, 2016, 07:42:11 PM »
Help me understand these international rules.  I understand, he who scores last when it ends in a tie, wins - most of the time.

In his loss to the Turk, Cox gave up the first point on the shot clock.  0-1.  Cox then ties it with an offensive point with the push out.  But he loses because of giving up the shot clock point first.

In his bronze match, Cox scores the first point on the shot clock 1-0. The Cuban is about to tie it off the shot clock and according to the ref does with no TD before the whistle, 1-1.  Now according to the rules, since the Cuban scored on the shot clock last e would have won if not for the successful challenge.

Given these two circumstances, the offensive push out point carries less weight than a passivity point off the shot clock.  Is that correct?

Yes, because the shot clock point is a caution and a point.  If the score is tied and the size of the scores is the same (not one guy has a 2 and the other guy has scored 1 twice), number of cautions is the next criteria.  That is why its worth "more".  The caution is often glossed over, but its why the official puts his other hand out while awarding the 1.
I thought the shot clock is called for a second caution. If memory serves both wrestlers had a caution but J'den got a second one and was put on the clock.Maybe I'm wrong.

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: Cox & Dlagnev
« Reply #29 on: August 20, 2016, 09:53:32 PM »
Help me understand these international rules.  I understand, he who scores last when it ends in a tie, wins - most of the time.

In his loss to the Turk, Cox gave up the first point on the shot clock.  0-1.  Cox then ties it with an offensive point with the push out.  But he loses because of giving up the shot clock point first.

In his bronze match, Cox scores the first point on the shot clock 1-0. The Cuban is about to tie it off the shot clock and according to the ref does with no TD before the whistle, 1-1.  Now according to the rules, since the Cuban scored on the shot clock last e would have won if not for the successful challenge.

Given these two circumstances, the offensive push out point carries less weight than a passivity point off the shot clock.  Is that correct?

Yes, because the shot clock point is a caution and a point.  If the score is tied and the size of the scores is the same (not one guy has a 2 and the other guy has scored 1 twice), number of cautions is the next criteria.  That is why its worth "more".  The caution is often glossed over, but its why the official puts his other hand out while awarding the 1.
I thought the shot clock is called for a second caution. If memory serves both wrestlers had a caution but J'den got a second one and was put on the clock.Maybe I'm wrong.

Difference between a passivity warning and a caution.  The second time you are warned for passivity, you go on the clock.  If the clock expires, you get a caution (little yellow mark on the scoreboard.  Cautions are used for criteria, but not warnings.  3 cautions (of any kind) end the match by DQ.