Author Topic: Bedlam  (Read 3729 times)

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #15 on: February 21, 2010, 09:50:21 PM »
Quote from: "ViseGrip"
I stand corrected on the Lapotsky/Gelogaev sequence. You are correct it WAS 6-3 after one.

Once again you have provided EXCELLENT analysis. However with two losses in a row to Patterson, I think your opinion of Notte is higher than mine. I fully expected Nottee to win this match but once again Patterson out slicked him and I think out thought him too.

I think your analysis of Parks/Bailey is pretty close too, but I dont think the difference between these two is as wide as what you probably do. Clearly Parks is better on his feet and is clearly quicker.  But I think Bailey has the edge on the mat and I think Bailey has better balance and is more comfortable in scrambles.It was pretty obvious that Bailey was wanting to get out of the 1st period 0-0 and it almost happened. And I think it was a blow to Park's confidence that he didnt get either of those TDs. By the 3rd Parks was trying to defend instead of attacking and got caught out of position. This will be a HUGE match in the Big V finals. I think Bailey gets the #1 seed now.

Yeah, I almost put 7.5 because I can't figure NottePatterson out.  It is certainly possible that Patterson has improved enough to be favored in that match up.  Chris gets another shot at him in the Big 12s so I guess we'll see.  I don't think Notte can afford to get behind because its too easy for Patterson to keep him at arms length after that.

I probably have a higher opinion of Parks than anyone, at least in what he is capable of, so thats not a big surprise.  Parks will now have to get by Schavrien in the semi's, but if he does I would hope that this match would serve as a reminder that he can't settle for 1 point leads.  He did that repeatedly last year and lost a number of matches doing so.  I thought he had figured that out, but he did the same thing today.  Anytime you have two AA caliber guys, the difference isn't going to be too large, but I really didn't think Bailey would ever beat Parks.  Obviously, the blue print on how to beat Jamal has been out for a while now (keep it close early and wait for him to wear down some late) and Bailey executed it well.  He is definately one of the 8-10 guys who is in the mix at 141.

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #16 on: February 21, 2010, 09:51:32 PM »
Quote from: "ViseGrip"
Quote from: "ViseGrip"
I stand corrected on the Lapotsky/Gelogaev sequence. You are correct it WAS 6-3 after one.

Once again you have provided EXCELLENT analysis. However with two losses in a row to Patterson, I think your opinion of Notte is higher than mine. I fully expected Nottee to win this match but once again Patterson out slicked him and I think out thought him too.

I think your analysis of Parks/Bailey is pretty close too, but I dont think the difference between these two is as wide as what you probably do. Clearly Parks is better on his feet and is clearly quicker.  But I think Bailey has the edge on the mat and I think Bailey has better balance and is more comfortable in scrambles.It was pretty obvious that Bailey was wanting to get out of the 1st period 0-0 and it almost happened. And I think it was a blow to Park's confidence that he didnt get either of those TDs. By the 3rd Parks was trying to defend instead of attacking and got caught out of position. This will be a HUGE match in the Big V finals. I think Bailey gets the #1 seed now.

As to the dual itself, I keep going back to that 4-2 lead by Maple that evaporated with 20 seconds. OSU is CLEARLY the better team, but the best team does not always wine. If we win THAT we may very well have stolen a win in a very inhospitable place. So I'm disappointed with a close loss and thats probably as good of an indication of OU's progress as anything.

That was insane.  You guys are a lot better, there is no doubt about that.  I just thought we were a top 3 team and after today I'm not as convinced.

Offline ViseGrip

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #17 on: February 21, 2010, 10:10:13 PM »
Quote from: "OkieSpladle"
Quote from: "ViseGrip"
Quote from: "ViseGrip"
I stand corrected on the Lapotsky/Gelogaev sequence. You are correct it WAS 6-3 after one.

Once again you have provided EXCELLENT analysis. However with two losses in a row to Patterson, I think your opinion of Notte is higher than mine. I fully expected Nottee to win this match but once again Patterson out slicked him and I think out thought him too.

I think your analysis of Parks/Bailey is pretty close too, but I dont think the difference between these two is as wide as what you probably do. Clearly Parks is better on his feet and is clearly quicker.  But I think Bailey has the edge on the mat and I think Bailey has better balance and is more comfortable in scrambles.It was pretty obvious that Bailey was wanting to get out of the 1st period 0-0 and it almost happened. And I think it was a blow to Park's confidence that he didnt get either of those TDs. By the 3rd Parks was trying to defend instead of attacking and got caught out of position. This will be a HUGE match in the Big V finals. I think Bailey gets the #1 seed now.

As to the dual itself, I keep going back to that 4-2 lead by Maple that evaporated with 20 seconds. OSU is CLEARLY the better team, but the best team does not always wine. If we win THAT we may very well have stolen a win in a very inhospitable place. So I'm disappointed with a close loss and thats probably as good of an indication of OU's progress as anything.

That was insane.  You guys are a lot better, there is no doubt about that.  I just thought we were a top 3 team and after today I'm not as convinced.

I STILL think you guys finish 2 or 3. One thing you have is a lot of kids with BIG TOURNAMENT experience, maybe not NCAA experience but high pressure national tournament experience. We wrestled better tonight than we did against Lehigh or ISU, but we're STILL a 8th-15th place NCAA team.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: There is never enough of anything to satisfy all that want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics" -Thomas Sowell

Offline Cicero

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #18 on: February 21, 2010, 11:44:47 PM »
I, for one, actually feel pretty good about this.  It wasn't the crisp performance I would have liked to see, but for a young team grinding out a tough win is a good thing.  They have grinded out close losses and ties, but this was a win.  

Prior to this, OSU's next closest win was 24-13 over Cal Poly.  And then the tie with OU in December.  Other than that blowout wins or close losses.  It is good they have been in this situation and now know they can win them.  

And even though the evidence is there, and we say the words I think it is hard to fully admit that OU is a solid team.  If they have a good national tournament I think this ugly win won't seem as ugly.
"The kinds of moves Oliver can hit are well beyond the kinds of moves I have the wrestling knowledge to describe" - LoSt

Offline SetonHallPirate

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2010, 11:55:26 PM »
Spladle-I didn't want to quote your entire post, but the official was Randy Hartman.

Offline ViseGrip

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #20 on: February 22, 2010, 12:04:05 AM »
Quote from: "SetonHallPirate"
Spladle-I didn't want to quote your entire post, but the official was Randy Hartman.
Someone needs to clue him in that he moves his hand WHEN he blows the whistle NOT BEFORE!!!!!!
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: There is never enough of anything to satisfy all that want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics" -Thomas Sowell

Offline SetonHallPirate

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #21 on: February 22, 2010, 12:39:49 AM »
Quote from: "ViseGrip"
Quote from: "SetonHallPirate"
Spladle-I didn't want to quote your entire post, but the official was Randy Hartman.
Someone needs to clue him in that he moves his hand WHEN he blows the whistle NOT BEFORE!!!!!!

I've seen worse procedural issues. I remember at National Duals, during the Cornell/Maryland dual, when the official (not sure who it was) gave two nearfall points on two separate occasions for one-counts. I actually took off the headset (I was announcing for LSV) after the second such instance, during the Dake/Krom match, and went over to Mike Allen, who was supervising the officials, to mention it to him. (I assume he told the official to take out his rulebook, open it to page WR-21, and read rule 2.9.1 over and over again until he got the clue, because it wasn't an issue again after that!)

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #22 on: February 22, 2010, 10:16:28 AM »
Quote from: "SetonHallPirate"
Spladle-I didn't want to quote your entire post, but the official was Randy Hartman.

Have you seen him officiate before, SHP?

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #23 on: February 22, 2010, 10:23:56 AM »
Quote from: "Cicero"
I, for one, actually feel pretty good about this.  It wasn't the crisp performance I would have liked to see, but for a young team grinding out a tough win is a good thing.  They have grinded out close losses and ties, but this was a win.  

Prior to this, OSU's next closest win was 24-13 over Cal Poly.  And then the tie with OU in December.  Other than that blowout wins or close losses.  It is good they have been in this situation and now know they can win them.  

And even though the evidence is there, and we say the words I think it is hard to fully admit that OU is a solid team.  If they have a good national tournament I think this ugly win won't seem as ugly.

I suspect that OU is a better dual team than NCAA tournament team, but time will tell.  You make a good point and the fact is that they did get the win over a top 10 team so that can't be too terrible.

Offline Cicero

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #24 on: February 22, 2010, 10:42:27 AM »
Bailey, Terry and Lapotsky seem like good bets to AA although none are title threats, regardless of Bailey's win over Dake.  They will probably be dangerously close to ending up in the top 10 depending on where those guys place and if they can get some production from there other guys.  I think Patterson, Vernon and James are probably going to go pretty deep if they don't AA.  Fernandez too provided all the other Big 12 guys stay on the championship side.
"The kinds of moves Oliver can hit are well beyond the kinds of moves I have the wrestling knowledge to describe" - LoSt

Offline OkieSpladle

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #25 on: February 22, 2010, 11:03:42 AM »
Quote from: "Cicero"
Bailey, Terry and Lapotsky seem like good bets to AA although none are title threats, regardless of Bailey's win over Dake.  They will probably be dangerously close to ending up in the top 10 depending on where those guys place and if they can get some production from there other guys.  I think Patterson, Vernon and James are probably going to go pretty deep if they don't AA.  Fernandez too provided all the other Big 12 guys stay on the championship side.

I agree except for James.  That guy is done.

Offline ViseGrip

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #26 on: February 22, 2010, 12:33:24 PM »
You two are higher on Lapotsky than I am. I give Vernon and Nathan Ferrnandez better shots at placing than Potsy. And if there is one guy on this team that has a chance of shocking the tournament with a huge upset, its Kendrick Maple.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: There is never enough of anything to satisfy all that want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics" -Thomas Sowell

Offline Cicero

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #27 on: February 22, 2010, 03:19:32 PM »
My perception was that he had been doing very well this season, but it appears you are right Haynes and Gelogaev are the only ranked opponents he has beaten.  He may have a tougher time at AA than I thought.
"The kinds of moves Oliver can hit are well beyond the kinds of moves I have the wrestling knowledge to describe" - LoSt

Offline SetonHallPirate

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #28 on: February 22, 2010, 05:16:17 PM »
Quote from: "OkieSpladle"
Quote from: "SetonHallPirate"
Spladle-I didn't want to quote your entire post, but the official was Randy Hartman.

Have you seen him officiate before, SHP?

Can't say I have.

Offline Old Number Nine

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Re: Bedlam
« Reply #29 on: February 24, 2010, 09:47:22 AM »
Quote from: "SetonHallPirate"
Quote from: "OkieSpladle"
Quote from: "SetonHallPirate"
Spladle-I didn't want to quote your entire post, but the official was Randy Hartman.

Have you seen him officiate before, SHP?

Can't say I have.

I was surprised to see him back after the way Firday's match went.  At one point after a heated discussion with Hartman, Coach Smith gave himself a bench warning as he walked back to the bench.