Author Topic: genetic variation  (Read 11247 times)

Offline coachsparky

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #15 on: September 21, 2011, 11:08:43 AM »
But the first single cell organism had enough DNA to give way to every creature on earth?

+1 for drmuscle

-1 for cougar, he should have read on and seen that scientist do not believe the first living singular celled creatures had any DNA whatsoever.  It took millions of years for that to develop from its precursors.
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Offline mako

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #16 on: September 21, 2011, 12:44:45 PM »
Back to the issue of genetic variance.  If we start with only 8 specimens,  there is not enough genetic variance among them to support a population of 5 billion plus.  When too few specimens of a population are used to create a larger population, a genetic bottleneck.  occurs.  This isn't a term I pulled out of my arse, there is plenty of literature on the problem.  Two examples of the genetic bottleneck can be found with the northern elephant seal, and also the cheetah.  In both species the genetic variance is close to zero.  Both of these populations were dwindled to fewer than 100 members.  The current populations of both species have members which are all genetically identical.  If the human race began with only 8 members, then all 5 billion plus of us would be genetically identical and that certainly is not the case.

Offline drmuscle

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2011, 01:20:31 PM »
If a genetic bottle neck disproves creation theory then it also has to disprove evolution. There is no way we get from single cells to every species on earth and every intermediate transition if the bottle neck theory is valid. If every thing gives way to the next then it had to be in the first building blocks. Your example of dogs should show you just how much variety there is in the generic code. Mixed breeding continues to yield dogs with entirely new characteristics right in our own life times.
From professing themselves to be wise they became fools.

Offline coachsparky

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2011, 01:31:44 PM »
If a genetic bottle neck disproves creation theory then it also has to disprove evolution. There is no way we get from single cells to every species on earth and every intermediate transition if the bottle neck theory is valid. If every thing gives way to the next then it had to be in the first building blocks. Your example of dogs should show you just how much variety there is in the generic code. Mixed breeding continues to yield dogs with entirely new characteristics right in our own life times.

Wrong, beneficial mutations help write the building blocks of all life, you are completely clueless about the science of biological evolution.  You should try to refrain from commenting on what you do not understand because it simply put makes you look stupid and foolish.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY

Offline drmuscle

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2011, 04:52:33 PM »
So a single cell organism with no DNA can give way to every living creature ever to exist, but 8 humans lack enough genetic variation to account for the various races and differences in people. I must sound so stupid.
From professing themselves to be wise they became fools.

Offline coachsparky

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #20 on: September 21, 2011, 05:19:58 PM »
So a single cell organism with no DNA can give way to every living creature ever to exist, but 8 humans lack enough genetic variation to account for the various races and differences in people. I must sound so stupid.

You do drmusclehead, trust me you do. It is people far far far far far smarter than you, and even smarter then me ;) who have figure this stuff out.  Of course you can take the intellectually lazy and immature way out and say it all happened by magic which is the world of fantasy and make believe.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY

Offline drmuscle

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #21 on: September 21, 2011, 05:31:41 PM »
You have just totally exposed your self as an anti religion zealot. You lack all objectivity because you being a self anointed intellectual know deep down that there is no way there could ever be a god and science must at all cost prove this. This thinking has brought us the global warming scam also endorsed by self anointed intellectuals.
From professing themselves to be wise they became fools.

Offline coachsparky

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #22 on: September 21, 2011, 05:37:46 PM »
You have just totally exposed your self as an anti religion zealot. You lack all objectivity because you being a self anointed intellectual know deep down that there is no way there could ever be a god and science must at all cost prove this. This thinking has brought us the global warming scam also endorsed by self anointed intellectuals.

No you prove your ignorance once again drmusclehead.  I actually believe in a God.  It has no personality, no gender and does not interact with human beings.  It is the same God that Stephen Hawkings and Albert Einstein believe it bu it is still God and it is the one and only God that has ever or could ever exist.  It is called Nature or the Universe and It has indeed created great things.  And you are so ignorant you still think there was some sort of global warming scam even that that whole argument was discredited some time ago.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2011, 05:43:49 PM by coachsparky »
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY

Offline ctc

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #23 on: September 21, 2011, 09:44:43 PM »
You have just totally exposed your self as an anti religion zealot. You lack all objectivity because you being a self anointed intellectual know deep down that there is no way there could ever be a god and science must at all cost prove this. This thinking has brought us the global warming scam also endorsed by self anointed intellectuals.
I don't argue with a moron.  He is on my ignore list.
"We can state with conviction, therefore, that a man's support for absolute government is in direct proportion to the contempt he feels for his country" - Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline mako

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #24 on: September 21, 2011, 10:13:09 PM »
One of the pitfalls of discussing scientific issues is being on the same page.  At this point, we don't even speak the same language much less being on the same page.  I am not talking about species origin or how life originated on the planet.  I am merely speaking to the flawed argument that the current world's population originated from 8 specimens.  I do not have a PhD, but I do have a pretty good working knowledge and education in physiology and genetics.  I certainly do not know how the first life came to be, and for all intents and purposes it doesn't concern me.  What does concern me is using flawed methodologies when discussing population growth curves.

Offline ctc

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #25 on: September 22, 2011, 08:00:10 AM »
You have trouble with 8 people?  Apparently, you have never heard of "Mitochondrial Eve".  You would really have problems with 2 people.  Obviously, you have no idea how much information is actually contained in DNA.  It is beyond comprehension.  There was no regional isolation with the early parents.  The loss of information didn't begin to happen yet.
"We can state with conviction, therefore, that a man's support for absolute government is in direct proportion to the contempt he feels for his country" - Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline coachsparky

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #26 on: September 22, 2011, 10:09:34 AM »
You have just totally exposed your self as an anti religion zealot. You lack all objectivity because you being a self anointed intellectual know deep down that there is no way there could ever be a god and science must at all cost prove this. This thinking has brought us the global warming scam also endorsed by self anointed intellectuals.
I don't argue with a moron.  He is on my ignore list.

Let's face it crazy texas coach, you don't argue with me because you know I am your intellectual superior.  I have decimated your ignorant, backward, redneck ass everytime you have tried to engage me.  I actually use science and facts and all you use is a book written by primative men some 6000-2000 years ago.  You have no chance when the odds are so obviously stacked against you.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY

Offline coachsparky

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Re: genetic variation
« Reply #27 on: September 22, 2011, 10:11:40 AM »
You have trouble with 8 people?  Apparently, you have never heard of "Mitochondrial Eve".  You would really have problems with 2 people.  Obviously, you have no idea how much information is actually contained in DNA.  It is beyond comprehension.  There was no regional isolation with the early parents.  The loss of information didn't begin to happen yet.

The mitochondrial eve had many Adams so it is far more then two people crazy texas coach, but perhaps you did not realize that.  I am not too surprised that you were ignorant of that fact.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark;  the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

Bigotry disguised as religious liberty is still BIGOTRY