Author Topic: Brackets ..  (Read 8123 times)

Offline Wire

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I finally became the man, my dog always thought I was.

Offline RYou

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2015, 10:18:10 PM »
Kindig doesn't get seeded and opens up with #3 3) David Habat, Edinboro

Kelly vs Demas at the opening bell....could be determining the tournament team title from round 1


Offline brycemus

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2015, 11:36:43 PM »
If that's the case better hand it to tOSU.
Corey Clark: 2016-2017 Hawkeye Hammer

Offline ViseGrip

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #3 on: March 12, 2015, 10:42:02 AM »
Kindig doesn't get seeded and opens up with #3 3) David Habat, Edinboro

Kelly vs Demas at the opening bell....could be determining the tournament team title from round 1

It looks like the seeding committe may be trying to send the Big XII IV a message.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: There is never enough of anything to satisfy all that want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics" -Thomas Sowell

Offline buck

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2015, 10:42:14 AM »
Not homerish at all, that one makes zero sense to me as well.
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Offline ViseGrip

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2015, 10:44:49 AM »
At the risk of sounding homerish.... I do not understand making Cody Brewer with a 17-1 record (the loss being a kinda freaky fall against Earl Hall who he just beat in the BIg XII IV finals) being a 13th seed. Then they give the #6 seed to Hall with 8 losses. Really?

Someone explain this to me.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: There is never enough of anything to satisfy all that want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics" -Thomas Sowell

Offline ac1998

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #6 on: March 12, 2015, 03:03:32 PM »
I don't undestand the seeding committee.  SOme have said that they punished kids who didn't wrestle the whole season (Delgado, Kindig) but Bo Jordan was hury for a big chunk of the year year (only 18 miatches) yet got seeded where everyone expected. 

They could make a policy that you need to have x number of matches to get a seed, and I'd be fine with that.  But they seemed to do that at some weights and not others.

Last thing, it's time to get away from the idea that previous years results don't matter. Of course they matter. It doesn't have to be the top criteria, but it should be on the list.  Setting aside Delgado's two NCAA titles becasue he was hurt this year is crazy.  It's not only unfair to him, but it's also unfaitr to the other guys in the bracket to work all season to get a seed and draw the defending champ in thr 1st round. 

Offline Cougar1

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2015, 03:51:59 PM »
I don't undestand the seeding committee.  SOme have said that they punished kids who didn't wrestle the whole season (Delgado, Kindig) but Bo Jordan was hury for a big chunk of the year year (only 18 miatches) yet got seeded where everyone expected. 

They could make a policy that you need to have x number of matches to get a seed, and I'd be fine with that.  But they seemed to do that at some weights and not others.

Last thing, it's time to get away from the idea that previous years results don't matter. Of course they matter. It doesn't have to be the top criteria, but it should be on the list.  Setting aside Delgado's two NCAA titles becasue he was hurt this year is crazy.  It's not only unfair to him, but it's also unfaitr to the other guys in the bracket to work all season to get a seed and draw the defending champ in thr 1st round.

Well said ac.
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Offline Gantry

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2015, 06:52:21 PM »
At the risk of sounding homerish.... I do not understand making Cody Brewer with a 17-1 record (the loss being a kinda freaky fall against Earl Hall who he just beat in the BIg XII IV finals) being a 13th seed. Then they give the #6 seed to Hall with 8 losses. Really?

Someone explain this to me.

How many quality wins did Brewer have besides Hall, who he was 1-1 against?    I honestly don't know, but I don't remember hearing about any other wins.  I'm guessing he didn't beat many other seeded wrestlers? 

Offline ViseGrip

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2015, 10:27:35 PM »
At the risk of sounding homerish.... I do not understand making Cody Brewer with a 17-1 record (the loss being a kinda freaky fall against Earl Hall who he just beat in the BIg XII IV finals) being a 13th seed. Then they give the #6 seed to Hall with 8 losses. Really?

Someone explain this to me.

How many quality wins did Brewer have besides Hall, who he was 1-1 against?    I honestly don't know, but I don't remember hearing about any other wins.  I'm guessing he didn't beat many other seeded wrestlers?

Hall got a lucky scramble fall in the dual and then Brewer beat him by 5 in the Conf finals. He's beat Harding OSU, # 16 McGuire KSU, DelVeccio Rut, Synon Mizz, Hathaway OrSU, He has also beaten Nick Soto who was ranked #13 at the time.

And he WAS an all American the last 2 years. This seeding isnt screwing Brewer as bad as it is DiJulius and Richards the #4 & #5 seeds.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: There is never enough of anything to satisfy all that want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics" -Thomas Sowell

Offline Gantry

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2015, 08:18:22 AM »
Seeders don't take "lucky scramble fall" into consideration, and they've clearly proven they aren't looking at last year's results.   So he's 3-1 against seeded wrestlers, two of those 3 are seeded higher than him.  I completely understand why folks think he should get a higher seed but if you base it strictly off this year there is some rationale.  I mean Beckman is the #10 seed and has much better wins than him.  Sabatello is #11 and he's beaten Richards and Guilbon off the top of my head.  Not sure about DiCamillo, but Brewer's 1-1 against guys ranked in the top14 (by seeds) and his lack of tough competition hurts him.  He missed a good chunk of the year where he would have faced top10 competition and that did him in.   

Again, not saying its right but it seems like the seeders have a somewhat consistent formula they are using.  If you throw out the previous year and look at his results strictly in terms of 2014/2015 it's at least defensible to me.  It's tough because when Brewer/Delgado were missing most of the season everyone was still complaining about how they are staying ranked despite not wrestling.  Then when they get penalized for that come NCAA seeds people are complaining the other way. 

It all comes down to taking previous years into consideration - I think maybe after this year they tweak it to give at least some weight to previous AAs and especially champs.  I think they have to because nobody actually thinks that there are 12 guys better at 133 than Brewer.  But you also have to reward the people that wrestle all the tough matches throughout the year.  I'm glad it's not my job...

Offline buck

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2015, 10:13:33 AM »
Beckman has been wrestling better but it's unlikely that he'll improve upon his 6th from last year.  Not enough firepower.
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Offline ViseGrip

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2015, 10:14:22 AM »
17-1.... is STILL 17-1. And he does own the most recent win over Hall who is the #6 seed with six losses.  There isnt a ranking out there that had him this low.

It doesnt make sense.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: There is never enough of anything to satisfy all that want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics" -Thomas Sowell

Offline brycemus

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2015, 11:03:44 AM »
I hope this link to acrobat.com works.  I uploaded my brackets to it. 
https://cloud.acrobat.com/file/93189cb5-09e4-4d9d-b957-fffda0c6acf7
Corey Clark: 2016-2017 Hawkeye Hammer

Offline brycemus

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Re: Brackets ..
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2015, 11:04:11 AM »
I have Iowa with 8 all americans and Mizzou with 6.  but i do have Mizzou with 3 finalists and two champions.
Corey Clark: 2016-2017 Hawkeye Hammer